I was at 72nd and Boundary Bay yesterday, Nov 19 and I was there taking photo's and was on my way to get a closer shot of a Snowy......the snowy was not more than a dot in my 300mm. I was talking with someone from Victoria at the time when he said that there was a snowy close to the shoreline. I started to make my way over to where the snowy was. I noticed a number of photographers also making their way over to where it was. They got there very quickly. I never got close enough to even get a descent shot though(got a shot of it flying away but still only small in my viewfinder) as one of the photographers kept trying to get closer and closer until the snowy finally decided to fly further down the shoreline to get to a more solitary place. From my judgement in seeing a how close the photographer was, it looked to me like he was only about 30ft away from it before it flew. To me, I think the person was not respecting the space of the snowy. The other photographers did keep some distance but they all could have got excellent shots if the closest photographer didn't push his luck by trying to move closer and closer. It does show that not everyone knows that we need to respect these beautiful birds from a distance that will still allow them to be at ease and not stress them to the point that they need to leave.....those of us with our long lenses do keep our distance (because we can) but those who don't tend to "push" their luck......

This is making a mountain over a mole hill. I would venture to say most of these owls do not know what a human is. They treat us like they would a herd of cows. You or a cow come too close they fly away. Do you know how curious cows are? Obviously not too concerned as they don't fly far. These birds are under no more stress than they are every day.
Remember the Hawk Owl, all the whining about being too close and harassing the owl. He was catching voles between the people and flying between them to eat. Did he looked stressed to you? The only one that was harassed was the poor people who had that owl in their yard. It's time to stop anthropomorphising.

Hugh Jarse

Any Snowy that ends up in southern BC is bound to already be under some amount of stress. This is backed up by the numbers found dead or brought to rehabbers each and every time we have a significant flight year. Even in years when we don't have a flight year, the number reported by birders is often lower than the numbers found dead or brought in to rehabbers.

Although some continue to complain that this is no big deal, all of the available scientific data, and most experienced birder and naturalists would disagree. In areas with a high number of potential disturbances, the amount of energy used in each disturbance event is cumulative and eats into the required time budget of the individual. Every species has a biological requirement for certain things and must meet these requirements in order to remain healthy. With birds, food, rest, and feather maintenance are generaly the highest priorities. In many species, these three things alone can take up a large portion of each 24 hour period. When disturbance begins eating into the time available for any of those things, it is to the detriment of that individual. Sometimes fatally so. In birds that are already stressed, and that are bound to end up in areas where there is likely to be significant human disturbance on top of disturbance for reasons beyond our control, we need to ensure that our actions will cause no disturbance at all. Some folks are claiming that this topic is uneccesary. Reading the responses in some of these posts, I think it is obvious that some people lack a general understanding of what these birds are up against in relation to their biological needs. In imparting some of this information, which I would hope that others continue to research on their own, hopefully we can stem some of the disturbance out there that is preventable. And this applies to everybody out there.

After the debacle with the Northern Hawk Owl south of Nanaimo several winters ago, I have completely changed my attitude concerning owls. Throwing rocks, shouting, whistling, trespassing, baiting, breaking down fences, trimming vegetation, all occured with a vicious frequency for months, and nobody seemed willing to do anything about it. And this on Vancouver Island. In urbanized areas, well, it boggles the mind. I saw a Snowy Owl on Vancouver Island yesterday. I viewed it through a scope from app. 400 meters away, and it was asleep for the two or so minutes my wife and I viewed it. It never once responded to our presence, and we went no closer to it after we noticed it was there. Because the bird was in an area with a history of high disturbance, I will not be reporting the sighting. This seems to me the best way to mitigate potentially life threatening disturbance to these birds.

thanks,

Guy L. Monty
Nanoose Bay, Vancouver Island, BC

Considering people know where you live and that you said it was in an area with a history of high disturbance don't you think you just narrowed it down for people to find it now.

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Mike Baker

http://mikebakerphotography.zenfolio.com/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/canonshooterman/

I considered that before I posted and acted accordingly. I don't live anywhere near the area in question, there are dozens of areas on the east coast of Vancouver Island which host Snowy Owls from time to time, and have a history of disturbance issues. As well, this bird was not easy to see and was apparently missed by the four photographers that were actively scouring the area searching for owls while we were there. So, no, I don't think I have endangered the individual in question with this post. It is always a consideration though, and I appreciate you bringing it up.

thanks again,

Guy L. Monty
Nanoose Bay, Vancouver Island, BC

In response to Hugh's comments regarding the Westham Island hawk-owl:

I agree that this bird was, for the most part, tolerant of the hordes of birders and photographers. For me (and I think more most people), the issue was not disturbance of the bird (since it was obviously hunting/roosting quite successfully), but rather the appalling disregard for private property. Nearly every time I passed by there were 5-10 photographers walking around on the home-owners lawn and even in the garden. On several occasions, the residents made it extremely clear that they were very upset about this and yet people continued to tramp all over the place just to get a "closer shot."

Snowy Owls on the other hand are a totally different ballgame. Unlike hawk-owls that can perch in places where humans can't get at them, Snowies are forced to flush continuously as people approach. As Guy pointed out, many of the Snowy Owls that make it this far south, are usually not in great shape (at least initially) because of their long journeys and the lack of food further north. This is why most of them probably perish en route. In a flight year like this, many birds will probably start bulking up again and should be quite healthy by January, given the bounty of food along Boundary Bay.

But with all that said, I can't understand why anyone would suggest that we have zero impact on these birds? Is there something un-cool about respecting wildlife? I believe that everyone has the right to get a good look at an owl but why not show a bit of restraint? Seems easy enough.

In addition to the Snowies, think about the impact we're having on Short-eared Owls that should be roosting during the day but are constantly being flushed by people trying to get closer to the Snowies. This disturbs their resting-patterns but it also exposes them to predators such as hawks, eagles, and even Snowy Owls.

And I haven't even mentioned habitat impacts yet...

Just a few things to think about.

Russ Cannings
Burnaby, BC

Russ, I think most guys on the forum will agree with you and Guy, etc. BUT notice how the initial attack was aimed squarely at bird photographers.

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Deon van der Heever
Maple Ridge, BC

http://www.flickr.com/photos/deonvanderheever/

I would like to clarify that I have no issues with Photographers, but rather I do have issues with people who do not respect wildlife. I've met many photographers that know to keep a proper distance, this has even been proven during this discussion, however I have observed many that do not.

The fact is, if u spend more than 5 minutes down at boundary bay you will realize 98% of the people out in the tundra are Photgraphers.

I don't know about the experiences of others on this forum, but the last time I checked I never saw any cyclists or joggers out in the tundra.

Russ, I agree we all have an impact on the Owls. I also have a great deal of respect for wildlife and only spent about an hour with the Hawk Owl, as it was a zoo and like I said I too worried about the homeowners. I never even tried to take a pic of the Saw-Whet. I just don't think the vitriol aimed at photographers is warranted.
Birds are enjoyed by many people in many different ways. I don't make a point of telling others what they may or may not do. I usually walk away. If someone were to walk up to me while I was Flyfishing and tell me I was harassing the trout and disrespecting them I wouldn't take it kindly.
As for Nuclear Bob, there a lots of bikers, runners and walkers out there on the dikes and they flush anything in their path without any regard to wildlife. Also where is this "tundra" you speak of?

Hugh Jarse

There are a few posters that are posting in anonymity and I think they should be accountable for their words. I think putting your real name on a post is a good way to ensure you're a little more thoughtful in your words and not just taking shots at people. It is not a requirement on this forum but hiding behind an alias may help keep these discussions more level and civilized.

Jeremy Gatten
Saanichton, B.C.

Dear Russ, please read my last post thoroughly, as I mentioned before I have no problem with photographers in general. But rather only those who tend to harass wild life and feel the need to get to close.

As for your comment on joggers and cyclists flushing wild life, this is simply a weak argument. The major difference is people tend to stay on the same paths, and the animals can choose to leave that area and head away from the paths. The joggers are not following the animals and are not trying to get as close as possible.

I would also like to thank you for correcting me, as I meant Salt Marsh instead of Tundra.

Sincerely Bob

I would also like to say to Jeremy my real name is Bob, it is not an alias.

The fact that people are attacking me personally only proves that some people on this forum have no valid excuses to their actions, and simply do not like having their actions publicized.

The fact that this old boys club simply does not have any self-restraint is concerning, and if some of those bad apples who feel the need to harass wild life cannot police themselves, the government ought to.


Bob


"The most dangerous people are the ignorant."
-Henry Ward Beecher

Maybe if you stop the (unfounded) accusations, we'll start taking you more seriously. I think you're nothing but a troll.

Oh and the correct spelling is "elitist" and not "elitest"

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Deon van der Heever
Maple Ridge, BC

http://www.flickr.com/photos/deonvanderheever/

Oh Bob... I hope you have a drawer full of corks because your logic is full of holes. Your heart is in the right place but you're doing more harm than good by fueling your posts on emotion and less on level-headed reasoning.

As for this being an "old boys club", you'd realize you're quite a ways off the mark if you knew the birding community. You seem to be fixated on blame and not watching what some of the people are saying. I am not a photographer and I don't agree with harassing wildlife. Flinging blame behind a computer screen might not be the best way to get your point across - especially if you claim you were watching all this harassment going on while you were viewing the owls. Why not take that opportunity to confront the issue?

Jeremy Gatten
Saanichton, B.C.

As of the last two posts I would like to apologize for lumping in everyone in this forum as being the same when I know for a fact that is not true.

The reason I brought this up in the forum was to create awareness of proper wild life educate, and I feel I have done that. Just by visiting the home page I have noticed more and more topics appearing that talk about wild life educate, so I feel I have accomplished something positive.

Although there are some people who will always disagree with me, that is fine they are entitled to their opinion. All I ask is for people to respect the snowy owls; they will be here all winter.

For those who are reading this please visit the link below and educate yourself properly, or simply refresh your memories, because we could all use a little refresher once and a while.

As for this topic this will be my last post, as I feel I have brought enough awareness to this forum, and I feel the topic has gone off topic. However I am not "trolling". I do enjoy birding and discussing important issues. Therefore I feel excited to have joined this forum and look forward to discussing other issues in the future.

Thank you for reading my posts and I hope to run into most of you during our birding adventures.

Sincerely Bob


http://www.env.gov.bc.ca/fw/wildlife/viewing/responsibleviewing.html